The truth of the matter is the helmets are different. I suppose it also is one of the images of the start of WWII for the US with forces in the Pacific wearing it while under Japanese attack at Wake Island and Pearl Harbour. Nevertheless there was some effort to produce a more advanced version of the M1917. Will be adding helmets to the page soon, alexanderandsons I'm putting in a picture. Highland Light Infantry who died 19/03/1915 LE TOURET MEMORIAL France ' Though, my opinion is that the helmet is an American M1917. By DizzyDeano96 12 months ago. document.write; I helmet was made up of 12 percent manganese. WWII British Air Raid Warden Brodie helmet, painted green with white 'W You can post now and register later. Just sold the ARVN ranger helmet. var day=mydate.getDay() Helmets such as this did not leave the factory this way. W. = Westinghouse Electric Co - Pennsylvania. The M1 became the standard issue helmet for American servicemen during the Second World War following the USs entry into the conflict in the aftermath of the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbour in December 1941. The helmet is an American M1917 made for the American Expeditionary Force, but very few made it to, The stamp mark on the helmet looks like ZC 3 which is thought to belong to the Edward. Copyright Treasure Bunker Ltd It was also used regularly for cooking or heating up food, though the practice was discouraged, as over time it made the metal more brittle and the helmet less effective at protecting the wearer if he was shot in the head. var fontstart = '' So is there actually a difference? dailyinfo[22]=' 25368 Quartermaster Serjeant Leonard Henry CADE Meritorious Service Medal 12th Coy. Brodie Helmet in Collectable Wwi Military Hats & Helmets Category. This website uses cookies for functionality, analytics and advertising purposes as described in our, "I pressed forward with the others to watch the United States physically entering the War, so god-like, so magnificent, so splendidly unimpaired in comparison with the tired nerve-racked men of the British Army. Irish Guards who died 18/03/1916 CALAIS SOUTHERN CEMETERY France ' After 1936 a new helmet was produced by McCord Radiator Co, the helmets were stamped with 1 or 2 digit numbers, and 1 letter on the rim, all the helmets have the same paint and texture when in factory condition unlike the modified. The Brodie has been described by the Imperial War Museum as "a masterpiece of simple design", while militaria expert Martin Pegler calls it "the most instantly recognisable symbol of the British Tommy", although most troops would not have referred to it by by the same name. Please consider supporting our videos on Patreonhttps://www.patreon.com/simplehistoryThe British Helmet in World War IJohn L. Brodie had invented and patente. Royal Navy who died 15/03/1917 CHATHAM NAVAL MEMORIAL United Kingdom ' I would leave the chin strap that is original, it's up to you what you want to do, with the helmet shell, it would have had an originalBMB liner dated the same as the shell, but I've seen BMB helmets with other maker. They also have a similar liner and chinstrap. Helmet, Belgian This is an excellent true combat example of a genuine Canadian Mark 1 steel helmet that is dated 1941. Few military helmets that have ever been manufactured are as iconic as the Brodie helmet. Manufacturing Co - Philadelphia - Pennsylvania. Is it a BEF or US helmet? M1 fixed bail, 34th ID "Red Bull" w/ Mickey Mouse Camo. After the war he was, as prior stated, he held a very high position and worked in surveying land and buildings for military purposes, including Goonhilly which was his most famous and he even chose that name. Frankston RSL Sub Branch Munition, German 75 mm. Meccano dailyinfo[23]=' 9656 Private Isaac COOPER "A" Coy. Both helmets are made from hardened manganese steel. [1] Contents 1 Background The unpainted shell was dipped onto a vat of olive paint. JOHN THE BAPTIST, LAWRENCE AND ANN) CHURCHYARD United Kingdom ' Or there are new reproduction liners also on line for sale. inspection stamp mark I've seen them before on liners. Steel Helmet, Brodie "War Office" pattern: British Army 2nd Bn. var daym=mydate.getDate() The insignia is for the US 77th Division. var daym=mydate.getDate() dailyinfo[2]=' 8020 Serjeant Charles POOLE "C" Coy. The chinstrap isn't a British one, or at least it's not a wartime example. Available in two sizes: ABB9300-1 58 cm, US 7 (Small) ABB9300-2 61 cm, US 7 5/8 (Large) A note on sizing, larger size liner may protrude slightly from the bottom of the helmet. I am pretty sure the ww2 helmet was worn protecting/ patrolling the British Houses of Parliament after he was injured in standard service. Identifying a Mk.1* British Civil Defence Brodie. The story, for many years I wanted a bog standard WW2 Cdn pattern helmet for my collection, mainly a display piece. When the First World War erupted in the autumn of 1914 all of the major powers were lacking any type of military headgear which could offer effective protection in the face of modern warfare and weaponry. This differed from the British helmet, as the Mk. if (dailyinfo[daym] != "") { document.write(fontstart+dailyinfo[daym]+fontend) } DPB I am pretty sure the ww2 helmet was worn protecting/ patrolling the British Houses of Parliament after he was injured in standard service. //-->, By Palace of Westminster Home Guard cap badge. dailyinfo[7]=' Lieutenant Thomas Sydney Ough DEALY Australian Flying Corps who died 07/03/1918 STONYHURST COLLEGE BURIAL GROUND United Kingdom ' Yet there is one piece of military headgear from the twentieth century which was used not just in the Second World War, but also in the Korean War, the Indochina or Vietnam War, the Iran-Iraq War, the Falklands War, the Yugoslav Wars, the First Gulf War and a range of smaller conflicts such as the Cambodian Civil War and several localized clashes in Central America and the Caribbean during the 1970s and the 1980s. While British and American helmets may be painted similar colors the finishes on the two type of helmet differ. WWII US M-1 101st AIRBORNE 506st PIR HELMET ALL ORIGINAL. By holding a British shell in one hand and an American shell in the other the weight difference is obvious. Four Bees: British Brodie Helmet MkI, WW1, manufactured - Blogger By knowing about a few small details the buyer will never make the mistake of purchase the wrong helmet. dailyinfo[1]=' Staff Nurse Edith Mary CAMMACK Associate of the Royal Red Cross, 2nd Class 4th Southern Gen. Hos. Wwi Italian Army M1915 Adrian Combat Helmet My buddy has a Brodie Helmet which he might be offering for sale. WW1 British Brodie Helmet recovered from the SOMME. Brodie style helmet with leather liner? normal? Both were manufactured using a similar process. Frank Harrison EDINGER Army Chaplains Department who died 26/02/1918 HOLLYBROOK MEMORIAL, SOUTHAMPTON United Kingdom ' Original WWII British Brodie Steel Helmet in OD Green- WW2 Dated $114.95 400 sold ORIGINAL WWII BRITISH / CANADIAN 1941 HELMET $49.88 $18.00 shipping WW2 Canadian Dispatch Rider Helmet $149.00 0 bids $22.80 shipping 5d 17h Antique World War 2 British Brodie Helmet WW2 $44.00 0 bids $13.30 shipping 3d 11h or Best Offer For a quarter of a century between the early stages of the First World War through to the first years of the Second World War the Brodie was the standard issue headgear for all British troops. . Im thinking about making a visit to the Imperial War Museum in London to show one of their specialists as it seems to be hard to find information about it. Is it possible to take a better picture of the helmet, are there any markings inside? ( ZA-Marks belong to the Crosby Manufacturing Co. ), ( ZB-Marks are thought to belong to the Worchester Pressed Steel Co. ), ( ZC-Marks belong to Edward. 2nd Bn. The helmet has been varnished. These heavy finishes were field or depot applied. I'm sorry I could not find a post 1916 stamp (see below for two examples of post Aug 1916 stamps. Military helmets - an introduction | Australian War Memorial McCord Radiator, Ford Motor Company were both known to have made P17s, but there wereundoubtedly more. Colloquially, it was called the shrapnel helmet, battle bowler, Tommy helmet, tin hat, and in the United States the doughboy helmet. Could be Kenny, it's not a British stamp mark socould have beenmade by one of the allied countries , if, it is American then it could be a M1917AI used between 1936 - 1941, the same period the MKII chin-strap. in the late 1930s - 1941 and the M1 helmet and liner was phased in 1941 - 1942. While the M1917 and Brodie helmets appear very similar, a few characteristics like the chinstrap ball, construction material and paint were slightly different. Hi Tom, welcome to the forum. We live day by day, and I always say: yesterday is history, today's reality, and tomorrow's a dream.' i read threads forum about brodie he There is also a drill hole on rear of the brim. The Brodie helmet, called Helmet, steel, Mark I helmet in Britain and the M1917 Helmet in the U.S., was a steel combat helmet designed and patented in 1915 by the Briton John L. Brodie. By this time a number of additional changes had been introduced to the rim design and the helmet was now known as the Mark I. Lincolnshire Regiment who died 05/03/1916 CITE BONJEAN MILITARY CEMETERY, ARMENTIERES France ' // Stop Define Variables for days of the month I have had a good look at your helmet again and managed to find another one to compare,This is an American, Here is a British made helmet from the same period, look at the rim joint how clean the joint is put together, now take a look at the rim joints. dailyinfo[30]=' B/469 Worker Charles BARLOW Australian Munition Worker who died 30/01/1918 NORTH SHEEN CEMETERY United Kingdom ' I would say the paintwork on your helmet is original. I'll ask about the bail rivets. Clear editor. Keeping a village shop going, Upcoming changes to logging in - click here, GWF is free to use so please support the Forum. Help with helmet identification - CMP Forums These original British Brodie helmets were designated the Mk 1 Steel Helmet, and nicknamed after the inventor who designed and patented them in 1915, "John Leopold Brodie". The helmet was manufactured in just one stamping procedure. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Kings Royal Rifle Corps who died 02/03/1915 YPRES (MENIN GATE) MEMORIAL Belgium ' Production of the Mk 1 Brodie helmets . dailyinfo[6]=' 345190 Sapper Forrest A. KNOWLES Canadian Signal Corps who died 06/03/1921 REIDS MILLS CEMETERY Canada ' Helmets and Headgear. dailyinfo[24]=' Captain Denzil Robert THURSTON Air Force Cross Airship Training Wing (Cranwell). I have a WW2 British helmet. How do I tell if it's real or fake? Should I get a replacement liner and chinstrap or just leave it as it is? were refurbished and modified with a new leather liner and web chinstrap. loop/lug was first used on the British MKI* and MKII helmets. whitman75 6 years ago. Irish Guards who died 18/03/1916 CALAIS SOUTHERN CEMETERY France ' While the basic structure of the M1 remained relatively unchanged in the years that followed, the liner went through many different designs. dailyinfo[12]=' 457 Lance Corporal Arthur Price ROWE 2nd/7th Bn. man in charge. It was owing to its shape that the German forces on the Western Front began to refer to the helmet as the Salatschssel or salad bowl. Upon the United States entry into the global conflict in April 1917 it urgently needed supplies of the new kinds of steel military headgear which the French, British and Germans had developed since 1915. HEAT STAMP 626A. Clear editor. Both manufacturers stamped their helmets with a two to four-digit number followed by a letter, but Schlueter also stamped an 'S' beneath their heat stamps. Imperial Russian Adrian helmet. Paste as plain text instead, It's easy! "Foyle." It's the bottom left helmet in the photo (sorry this is the only one he has) I know that's not a lot to go on, but can anyone gather some info from this? It does not have that stamp so it is probably one from world war 2 then. Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for WW2 British Army MkII Brodie Helmet MkI Liner - 1939, MKII Chinstrap at the best online prices at eBay! U.S. P17 chinstrap bail dailyinfo[28]=' 19673 Leading Aircraftman Samuel Ambrose TICKNER Meritorious Service Medal No. Guide Of US Helmets From 1915 To 1983 - WW2 Helmets Results 1 to 3 of 3 blue brodie helmet(or not) identification. Brodie Helmet - Etsy Welcome to the forum SR71, there's not much to go on without it's liner. Royal Marine Light Infantry who died 17/03/1918 BELLAVISTA OLD BRITISH CEMETERY Peru ' dgirardin 11 months ago. Here is an image ( sorry for bad quality) There are 3 letters painted on the front i think it could be either one of these combinations: WW1: Combat helmet technology - the Brodie steel helmet The helmets I have seen wereUSM1 helmets, however they might have worn the Brodie pattern too earlier on. stepback_antiques 12 years ago. In conclusion, the M1 can probably be designated as the most successful combat helmet ever made. Bluecher German Navy who died 29/01/1915 CANNOCK CHASE GERMAN MILITARY CEMETERY United Kingdom ' dailyinfo[13]=' 37643 Sapper Thomas John ECCLESTON Tunnelling Coy. Your link has been automatically embedded. In the years after the end of the war the American Infantry Board tested a number of new models, but each of these were deemed to not mark any real improvement on the earlier design. dailyinfo[20]=' 10259 Private Charles BUCHANAN 1st Bn. While the US Manufacturers developed their own M1917 helmet and got production, up to speed, very few of the M1917s made it to the Western Front before the Armistice. Although to the untrained eye the helmets may look the same, it in the small details where the differences may be observed. what I can tell you is that, it appears to be from the WW2 period with the cropped helmet lugs, the markings I've not seen. Pasted as rich text. WW2 British Army MkII Brodie Helmet MkI Liner - 1939, MKII Chinstrap He was the head ofthe South-West ministry of publics works. John Brodie designed the 'tin helmet' as worn in WW1, hence its name. Military Helmet Identification and Price Guide - MilitaryItems.com I'm sorry I don't have the answer to your question, but (and I apologise profoundly for what follows) - what's this about another Great War Forum? 25.00 1 bid 5.35 postage 5d 19h Click & Collect Repro British Army WW2 Plastic Helmet Tommy Doughboy Brodie Style WWII Soldier 12.99 Click & Collect Free postage It's easy! WW2 ARP & Civil Defence Helmets & Markings Follow. This is an excellent . Powered by Invision Community, Brodie Steel trench helmet Identification marks, Upcoming changes to logging in - click here, GWF is free to use so please support the Forum. The British Mark I chinstrap bails are made from 16 gauge brass or in some cases steel wire. Paste as plain text instead, 3rd Bn. Liner Fibre M-1. helmet Bowl-shaped steel helmet showing remains of crude dappled camouflage colours of light brown and mid-green on an apple green field. I think I have read it is thought to be another mark of Firth and sons, but that make no reason for the K. I think it is quite a common mark though. dailyinfo[17]=' PLY/3566 Private Samuel ROBINSON H.M.S. During the State Opening of Parliament in 1942 they formed a guard of honour for the King in the Royal Gallery and in that same year were inspected by Churchill. Seaforth Highlanders who died 20/03/1919 BEIRUT WAR CEMETERY Lebanese Republic ' From left to right: A pair of clamped chin straps with male snaps for the parachutist M1 helmet and liner next to a pair of standard infantry chinstrap used from early 1950s to the mid-1970s. G. Budd, Manufacturing Co. (Salonika) Territorial Force Nursing Service who died 01/03/1918 KNOWLE (SS. F Thomas Firth and Sons Sheffield 1916 1918, FS Thomas Firth and Sons, Sheffield sept. 1915 1919, HS Hadfields Ltd. jan. Sheffield 1916 1919, BS W Beardmore & Co. Ltd. jan. 1916 1919, A Edgar Allen and Co.Sheffield Ltd 1916 1918, HH Harrison Bros. & Howson Ltd. dec. 1915. . The helmet resembles an upside down dishpan or washbasin in that it consists of a bowl-shaped cap and a large uniform brim running around the entire exterior. The British Mark I has a rubber ring sometimes called adoughnut sewn between two pieces of wool in the base of the helmet dome. We offer a 100% return policy. and 34th Coy. Unfortunately the helmet was in a shed for many years so is quite rusted. Over time this would nullify any anti-reflective properties the finish possessed thus putting the wearing in danger. Antique World War II helmet stamped and dated 1942 Canadian Army Brodie helmet made by General Steel Wares of Toronto shopatlanticcanada (133) $191.29 Vintage WWII Army Helmet 1940s Canadian Brodie MKII WyrembelskisVintage (1,643) $165.00 vintage army metal doughboy helmet IronCharlie (31) $345.00 FREE shipping Display as a link instead, As for the number/letter code, that is the code for the manufacturer and the manufacturer's lot number. Leinster Regiment who died 27/02/1918 JERUSALEM MEMORIAL Israel and Palestine (including Gaza) ' This style of helmet had been in use since the 1st World War and was often colloquially known as the Tommy helmet in the UK or as the Doughboy helmet in the US. Tom.Delahoyde The British did have an upgrade that was never adopted by the Americans. The Spanish helmet had a great deal of German influence because Germany equiped the Spanish armed forces during its civil war. The chinstrap was secured directly to the helmet brim and the liner was held into the skull with a single rivet on the top. Was wondering if anyone could give some more info on it. Brodie Steel trench helmet Identification marks Remembered Today: 1081780 Sapper Bedford Stanley LONG "D" Coy. dailyinfo[16]=' 22659 Serjeant George SNELL Military Medal "T" Bty. It wasundoubtedly a welcomerelief from having the helmet constantly bounce up and down on the top of the wearer skull while running across no mans land. There were at least six British helmet manufactures and nine steel suppliers. WW2 British Army Staff Officers Cap and Collar Tabs Available on our website now, Danish m23. It's definitely a British Mk I helmet. Helmets were procured from British supply until such point as the Americans could supply themselves with their own helmets. dailyinfo[22]=' 25368 Quartermaster Serjeant Leonard Henry CADE Meritorious Service Medal 12th Coy. $11295 Upload or insert images from URL. dailyinfo[5]=' 12147 Private Harry COOK 8th Bn. Both the British and American helmets have marking stamped into the steel on the underside of the helmets skirt. Pasted as rich text. dailyinfo[8]=' 13277 Labourer Klaas NERO South African Native Labour Corps who died 08/03/1917 PUGU ROAD 1914-1918 MEMORIAL Tanzania ' 6 Reserve Lorry Park Royal Air Force who died 28/02/1919 BELGRADE CEMETERY Belgium ' It looks like it's stamped 'JSS' above the date marking, which is the maker's mark for Joseph Sankey & Sons Ltd, who produced helmet shells from 1938 to 1941. That's how the helmet got its official name as well. The helmet was then heat cured creating a hard durable textured finish. There should not be a threaded nut. If anyone knows something about the helmet please tell me I'm very interested to here what you guy are going to say. Progressive Knitting Works - Brooklyn - New York. Who can tell me about this helmet British WW1 or WW2 or..?? The liner should be afixed in the helmet using a single copper rivet that is peened. It's a little difficult to provide much information from just a picture. For slow learners: A Brodie is simply the design of British Army helmet worn in both WWI and WW2, and not a particular type of WWI helmet? The threads that discuss the helmet will contain lots more information. Here is an image ( sorry for bad quality) Was the safety of a WW1 helmet called into question because M1 Helmet Identification; Shipping; Sizing; 1-877-862-5245; TOP POTS - DEDICATED TO M-1 HELMET PRESERVATION. Though I do not know the code for the manufacturers. In total approximately seven and a half million Brodies were produced by the British by the time that the First World War came to an end in November 1918. However, he has recently discovered that apparently all Brodie and Mk.I helmets were pressed by Joseph Sankey and Sons, so the the initials simply indicate the steel supplier. Head Gear POOR MANS MILITARIA. The M1 was eventually used in virtually every part of the globe, certainly everywhere that fell within the American sphere of influence during the Cold War, from the Balkans to much of South America and from West Germany to Singapore. BASICALLY A DESCRIPTION OF HOW THE WW1 MKI BRODIE EVOLVED INTO THE WW2 MK2 STEEL HELMET,VIA THE INTER WAR MK1* VERSION..AND HOW TO TELL THEM APART.EACH HELMET WILL ALSO HAVE ITS INDIVIDUAL. Royal Warwickshire Regiment who died 12/03/1918 ST. The man responsible for the design of the German Stahlhelm was Dr. Friedrich Schwerd of the Technical Institute of Hannover. Category:Brodie helmets. Powered by Invision Community, Second World War British Brodie Helmet Identification, Helmets- mainly WW2 British and Commonwealth, both Civil Defense and from field service. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. 1-877-862-5245; Home; Contact; About Us; Why Top Pots; Available on our website now This used brass case is approximately 75 mm diameter and is marked with a 1916 manufacturing date. In 1940 a Parliamentary Home Guard unit "The Palace of Westminster Company" was established, consisting of around one hundred Members and staff of both Houses. SEVER CEMETERY EXTENSION, ROUEN France ' Hello Gents, it's been a long time, but I am back with an ID request. Category:Brodie helmets - Wikimedia Commons Missing the chinstrap and liner. About this item Reproduction of the World War Two British Brodie Helmet complete with a sprung webbing chin strap. Royal Navy who died 15/03/1917 CHATHAM NAVAL MEMORIAL United Kingdom ' Itsin rough shape and I have yet to find a manufacture/heat stamp. U.S. M2 Pathfinder camo was particularly favored by members of the 82nd. It was superseded by the Personnel Armor System for Ground Troops or PASGT, a combination type of armour consisting of a ballistics vest and a combat helmet. Unlike the ubiquitous Stahlhelm which had been developed by the Germans around the same time the Brodie did not have a nape piece extending further down at the back to protect the neck, however, it did offer greater all round protection from shrapnel descending down into the trenches. Lots of exciting helmets coming in the near future. It seems to happen frequently. 5th Bde. The constant handling a helmet would receive in the field would compress the saw dust finish. Most American helmets lack manufacture marks. dailyinfo[4]=' Matrose Paul KURZKE Torpedoboot "G85" German Navy who died 04/03/1919 CANNOCK CHASE GERMAN MILITARY CEMETERY United Kingdom ' dailyinfo[21]=' L/32287 Driver John Frampton GAZE "O" Bty. I think it would be a perfect fit alongside the gas masks in the game, especially with the hype for Battlefield 1 and all. dailyinfo[27]=' 5778 Private William CUMMINGS 6th Bn. The British Mark I has a rubber ring sometimes called adoughnut sewn between two pieces of wool in the base of the helmet dome. dailyinfo[15]=' SS/342 Able Seaman Henry George SMITH (RFR/CH/B/5534). plant of Ford Motor Co of Philadelphia were they were painted and assembled. Steel Helmet | International Encyclopedia of the First World War (WW1) The result in 1940 was the M1, which was effectively an altered version of the M1917. Sign up for a new account in our community. Indeed so functional was it and easy to manufacture that the Brodie was purchased by many other countries and the design was adapted by several other European states and even by the United States. Helmets and Headgear, Shortly after the US declaration of war in April of 1917 the US ordered around 400,000 helmets from the British for use by, the American Expeditionary Force. colour is the paint finish of the helmet, in the photo it looks blue/grey ?. It was the standard military issue helmet, albeit with some slight alterations to it, for American soldiers in the Korean War and the Vietnam War, as well as a whole host of smaller conflicts and deployments down to the early 1980s. Both helmet have a similar dome and similar skirt. O Gauge garden model railway Worcestershire Regiment who died 23/02/1915 LOKER CHURCHYARD Belgium ' The British bail design proved to be too weak for the rigors of the trenches. . A British Brodie 'Tommy' steel helmet with net and leather lining. The dark green color and cork coating (to reduce the possibility of ight reflection) is very close to what the first M1 helmets had applied. The helmet was painted a camouflage mix of green, blue and orange, though a variety of alternative colours were also introduced for use in different theatres. By the by, not all MKIIs are British or even issued to troops. Whether it be a small antique shop, militaria show or even an online auction. Original WW1 US English AEF 79th ID British BRODIE M1916 Tommy 79 Helmet. OPB The British Mark I Brodie & the U.S. P17, know the difference These have some 115716872255 I am also unsure whether he began workingin Parliament before or after the war, i will be able to tell you tomorrow though. http://www.criticalpast.com/video/65675048436_military-helmets_assembling-helmets_dipping-into-paint-tanks_wooden-crates. . Brodie helmets - How to identify - Uniforms,Cap Badges and Insignia http://www.cefresearch.com/phpBB2/index.php, Here is a reply from Roger Lucy, who wrote the book TIN LIDS, "In his article on the Mk.I in Militaria # 6, July, 1994, the British helmet guru, Marcus Cotton, suggests that FKS probably stands for Thos. 2012-2023 WW2HELMETS.COM. and Gen. Hos. Here is a good thread with a posting describing the British manufacturer codes. Nevertheless the Brodie name persisted for many years afterwards.